31 replies to this topic

[Ryuu Tetsuhara]

Hi there,

A moment ago I just had a thought about what it takes to build and run a fully functional and successful unit in the Draconis Combine Mustered Soldiery (DCMS). Naturally, the size of the unit will have a great impact and while a larger number of troops under one's command offer greater military strength and more flexibility and, thus, possibilities in combat, this means also an increased responsibility and it will be more difficult to command.

What are your thoughts on this? Are you striving to command a lance, company, bataillon, or even a full regiment, if possible at some development stage in the game, or will you be happy enough to be a part of the Dragon and smoothly integrate in the military structure without ambitions for a command position?

If you were to command a unit (from the ranks of a Chu-i to a Tai-sa, in exceptions also that of a Sho-Sho), what size would you consider manageable or would you aim for having under your command?

What would you estimate as being crucial in order to form a functional and successful unit that honors the Dragon?

How would you run your unit and what could cause conflicts for your troops?

What type of mechwarrior skills would you like to see in your unit and which type of mechs would you choose or look for, from those available in MWO at present, to build your own unit with?

Edited by Ryuu Tetsuhara, 12 May 2012 - 08:22 AM.

[Paladin Brewer]

I'm sure many people will try to run their own units, just as many people try to run their own guilds in any other game. There is usually about a 75% failure rate. And even those who do well for a few months can easily stumble. In any case it is also important to note you will not be able to create custom DCMS regiments at launch. You can join a regiment as a faction player, however anyone is free to join and leave there and there does not seem to be any CoC structure, it's just for show.

This oversight by Piranha (sorry guys) is why some of us, as any faction, will probably go merc at release and only take contracts affiliated with our faction.

[Ryuu Tetsuhara]

Paladin Brewer, on 11 May 2012 - 07:29 PM, said:

I'm sure many people will try to run their own units, just as many people try to run their own guilds in any other game. There is usually about a 75% failure rate. And even those who do well for a few months can easily stumble. In any case it is also important to note you will not be able to create custom DCMS regiments at launch. You can join a regiment as a faction player, however anyone is free to join and leave there and there does not seem to be any CoC structure, it's just for show.

This oversight by Piranha (sorry guys) is why some of us, as any faction, will probably go merc at release and only take contracts affiliated with our faction.

Thanks for your input, I see your points and it would indeed be disturbing news, if everyone here would have to 'go mercenary' at some stage in order to be able to faithfully command a unit of mechwarriors on a regular basis. However, to my knowledge Piranha Games has not decided yet how the gameplay will be set up for the factions, and while randomization of assigning House players for mech matches may occur, there may also be an option to be assigned a rank/position (following initial training/academy and, possibly, the selection of a mech commander career path) as part of a regiment, hopefully, not just for show, although this may very well happen.

In the case that all the other lance, company, bataillon or regiment members are available (I know the latter would take quite some organisational skills) or a fraction thereof may suffice, there would certainly be an option to let commanding officers choose their participating mechwarriors or to allow the same group of people to work as an integrated unit in the DCMS rather than being forced to open a mercenary unit with DCMS allegiance. As you mentioned the original DCMS units have been banned intentionally by the developers, which is a shame as the rich BattleTech lore is not being used, but it will not necessarily have to be a hindrance. Maybe those unit names have been made unavailable to save them, so that Piranha Games can assign the player account characters to specific units (a system could be programmed that assigns new players based on their qualifications, career path, in-game experience, and promotion potential to the classical DCMS units at random ... naturally, such a system will be flawed at the start, but this approach could offer a solution for everyone after it has been optimised).

Possibly, a better option for faction unit commanders would be to look into who is online at that time and what mech types will this person be able to pilot based on the inventory/availability, if asked to join on a mission. Let us assume this scenario for now, also providing the possibility that the same people can assemble to allow the same unit composition on a regular basis.

I am not sure if the developers will read this thread as it seems that they are not paying too much attention to the faction talk MWO subforums, so your IMHO justified criticism is likely to be overseen. If, however, one of them will stumble across this, I hope that they will take it into consideration ... one never knows, if there is a reason why we are left in the dark regarding some important aspects of the game or whether or not the developers have not taken into account certain aspects yet, and not made a decision on the exact implementation in the near future ...

Anyhow, I also hope to see some feedback addressing the questions of my introductory posting ...

[Paladin Brewer]

No they did already discuss faction regiments, and custom faction units will not be available upon launch. I would find it for you but im heading out there door, but I would not have said it otherwise.

[Ryuu Tetsuhara]

Thanks for the clarification, then we may have to do with fake or fancy name units, instead of the real deal, if permitted by IGP. Will there still be hope for a faction lance, company, bataillon and regiment system as mentioned above (?) ... time will tell, I guess!

[Paladin Brewer]

Like I said, there will be custom faction units, but not at launch. However is doubtful (this is my opinion, not confirmed) that you will be able to use any Canon regiment for your custom faction units when they are available. Mostly because as I said, people will already be able to join them and "earn" their way into the elite status regiments through XP or whatever, but those units have no COC or real structure.

[Alizabeth Aijou]

Quote

I'm sure many people will try to run their own units, just as many people try to run their own guilds in any other game. There is usually about a 75% failure rate. And even those who do well for a few months can easily stumble. I

Yup... experienced that with Guild Wars.
Had my own guild with over a dozen people in it, went away for chi-mass, and when I came back the place was deserted because someone got promoted to a leadership position without my permission, who subsequently kicked everybody he could.
Still got my guild, although its pretty much a dead horse (Combine after Hohiro's treatment).

[Ryuu Tetsuhara]

@ Paladin Brewer & Alizabeth Aijou:

Fair enough, but since the game system currently developed by the Piranha Games/IGP is not entirely clear yet, the initial questions brought up in the introduction of this topic may still be regarded as theoretically valid, although it is likely that canonic faction structures will not be implemented upon MWO launch day.

This leads inevitably to the rheotorical question:

What is the point of having factions in MWO in the first place then?


In any case, here are some of my answers (soliloquy?):

Commanding a unit that exceeds the strength of a company (more than 16 mechs) would not be in my interest, due to the unit's inflexibility in combat and I think that I would have severe difficulties not to lose track of anything bigger (bataillon or regiment). While I would not shy away from the responsibility, a greater number of officers under one's command will automatically mean a larger reliability on others and I like to have my fate in my own hands to some extent. Moreover, my ambitions are limited (or in other words, I know my own limitations) and while commanding a lance would honestly more than suffice for me, the option of commanding four lances is very intriguing and a company offers heaps of possibilities, just enough potential to be truly meaningful on the battlefield and its size almost completely excludes the factor of luck that may still play a role and can be decisive in lance vs. lance combat.

If I were to command a lance and could choose its composition based on currently available mech types and not mission scenario specific but for universal applicability, it would look like this:

Lance (based on currently available mechs)
Mech 1 = Dragon (myself)
Mech 2 = Raven
Mech 3 = Awesome
Mech 4 = Catapult

If I were to command a company and could choose its composition based on currently available mech types and not mission scenario specific but for universal applicability, it would look like this:

Company (based on currently available mechs)
Lance 1
Mech 1 = Jenner
Mech 2 = Jenner
Mech 3 = Raven
Mech 4 = Jenner

Lance 2
Mech 1 = Hunchback
Mech 2 = Hunchback
Mech 3 = Centurion
Mech 4 = Dragon

Lance 3
Mech 1 = Hunchback
Mech 2 = Dragon
Mech 3 = Catapult
Mech 4 = Catapult

Lance 4
Mech 1 = Awesome
Mech 2 = Atlas
Mech 3 = Catapult
Mech 4 = Awesome (myself)

[Quentin Yatoki]

If you want my opinion, as long as Merc Corps can fight in battles for factions, then there is no problem, as long as you accept that you can't name your unit for a canon one. As long you can make a unit named "Ryuken-Ju" and only choose to fight for House Kurita, then you have effectively made your own DCMS Unit. True you probably won't gain house rank, but until we know the exact pros and cons of that, we can't dicuss whether it will be an issue.

With that in mind, I would be interested in forming a Ryuken or Genyosha styled unit, if anyone else is interested.

Edited by Quentin Yatoki, 22 May 2012 - 05:28 AM.

[Dechan Fraser]

Well since I'm Dechan Fraser I expect to have a command position in the Ryuken

[Capt Edgar Friendly]

Ryuu, you do realize that there are only 3 lances in a company right ?
3 lances = Company
3 Companies = Battalion
3 Battalions = Regiment
3 Regiments = Division

[PANZERBUNNY]

Paladin Brewer, on 12 May 2012 - 09:28 AM, said:

No they did already discuss faction regiments, and custom faction units will not be available upon launch. I would find it for you but im heading out there door, but I would not have said it otherwise.

I think calling them "faction units" is a bit of an error.

Players should be able to form their unique squads/squad names within a Regiment without souring any lore etc.

So what if a lance of mechwarriors is the 21st Dieron Rangers, Hell Badgers Lance.

Doesn't ruin the House units at all.

Remember they have said they will be enforcing those who want to use Canon unit names for their Merc force. The odds that they will allow people to name their units "Genyosha" etc is very, very slim.

I think we can all do without merc units called Clan Jade Falkon and Wolf Draegoons.

Edited by PANZERBUNNY, 29 May 2012 - 08:28 AM.

[Alizabeth Aijou]

Ryuu Tetsuhara, on 21 May 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

@ Paladin Brewer & Alizabeth Aijou:

Fair enough, but since the game system currently developed by the Piranha Games/IGP is not entirely clear yet, the initial questions brought up in the introduction of this topic may still be regarded as theoretically valid, although it is likely that canonic faction structures will not be implemented upon MWO launch day.

Annoyingly enough, yes.

Quote

Commanding a unit that exceeds the strength of a company (more than 16 mechs) would not be in my interest

Aren't companies in the DCMS always based around triple lance strength? Or 12 'Mechs?
Aerospace fighters are structured a bit differently, but still at 12 fighters per company

Quote

I think we can all do without merc units called Clan Jade Falkon and Wolf Draegoons.

Seyla.

[Capt Edgar Friendly]

Inner sphere rank structure looks something like this

4 mechs or 2 Aerospace or 4 tanks = a lance
3 lances = a company
3 companies = a battalion
3 battalions = a regiment
3 regiments = a Division

[Quentin Yatoki]

Kaneda, I'm going to be nitpicky and note that highest level unit organization in the DCMS are regiments. As best I can remember, Divisions don't exist in IS military nominclature. Davion Regimental Combat Teams are close, as they are modern combined arms Divisions in all but name. /nitpicking

Welcome to the DCMS.

Edited by Quentin Yatoki, 29 May 2012 - 04:47 PM.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Even RCT's, compared to modern day or WW2 sized divions aren't very large in terms of material, but since a planet is lucky to even have 1 Regiment on permanent defence, actual combats units tend to be a small amount unless it's a large operation.

YAY for raiding warfare!

[Charles Martel]

I'm partial to Brewer's approach, as if 2nd Legion of Vega isn't available in any meaningful way, I'll just set up my old TT non-canon unit as a Combine-loyal merc outfit.

[Paladin Brewer]

Actually beyond regiments we have 5 prefectures per military district, in which we also have 5.

[Soviet Alex]

For DCMS players, organise a group on Paladin Brewer's excellent House Kurita site (http://www.housekurita.org/) and do missions together. You can arrange command structure, unit compostition, etc. behind the scenes before you even log in to MW-O. Just because the game doesn't recognise you as a specific unit, doesn't mean you can't function like one.

Personally I'm planning to avoid the mercenary approach because I'd rather see the Draconis Combine grow than be promoted.

[Howling Mad Murdock]

We are working towards creating a decent lancer to play MWO even if it doesn't feature in game, it will still allow players to group together and fight as a unit